Debian Bug report logs - #701585
general: Can't select other languages

Package: locales; Maintainer for locales is GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>; Source for locales is src:eglibc.

Reported by: Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>

Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 19:27:02 UTC

Severity: normal

Tags: l10n

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Report forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, carlos.manso@gmail.com, debian-devel@lists.debian.org:
Bug#701585; Package general. (Sun, 24 Feb 2013 19:27:04 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>:
New Bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to carlos.manso@gmail.com, debian-devel@lists.debian.org. (Sun, 24 Feb 2013 19:27:04 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #5 received at submit@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>
To: Debian Bug Tracking System <submit@bugs.debian.org>
Subject: general: Can't select other languages
Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 20:23:55 +0100
Package: general
Severity: important
Tags: l10n

Dear Maintainer,
*** Please consider answering these questions, where appropriate ***

   * What led up to the situation?
	Trying to select another language of format in gnome-setting
   * What exactly did you do (or not do) that was effective (or
     ineffective)?
   * What was the outcome of this action?
   * What outcome did you expect instead?
	Select another format of the English language (Ireland in this case).


-- System Information:
Debian Release: 7.0
  APT prefers testing
  APT policy: (500, 'testing')
Architecture: i386 (i686)

Kernel: Linux 3.2.0-4-686-pae (SMP w/2 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_US.utf8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.utf8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash



Reply sent to Markus Frosch <markus@lazyfrosch.de>:
You have taken responsibility. (Sun, 24 Feb 2013 21:30:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Notification sent to Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>:
Bug acknowledged by developer. (Sun, 24 Feb 2013 21:30:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #10 received at 701585-done@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Markus Frosch <markus@lazyfrosch.de>
To: Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>, 701585-done@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: general: Can't select other languages
Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 22:26:27 +0100
Hello Carlos,
> Dear Maintainer,
> *** Please consider answering these questions, where appropriate ***

Debian-Devel is no user support channel for Debian.

Please discuss your questions over the user support channels:
http://www.debian.org/support
http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/

Btw. "dpkg-reconfigure locales" might help, and look for the
localization packages and tasks via APT/aptititude.

Regards
Markus
-- 
Markus Frosch
markus@lazyfrosch.de
http://www.lazyfrosch.de



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, debian-devel@lists.debian.org:
Bug#701585; Package general. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 07:39:14 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to debian-devel@lists.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 07:39:14 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #15 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>
To: 701585@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Markus Frosch <markus@lazyfrosch.de>, control@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 08:34:58 +0100
reopen 701585
reassign 701585 gnome-settings-daemon
severity 701585 normal
thanks

On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 09:30:03PM +0000, Debian Bug Tracking System wrote:
> Hello Carlos,
> > Dear Maintainer,
> > *** Please consider answering these questions, where appropriate ***
> 
> Debian-Devel is no user support channel for Debian.

No, but the BTS is (to some extent), and there are various tools that
suggest the package "general" if you don't know what the exact buggy
program is. When doing that, the package ends up on debian-devel.

Since the bug reporter mentioned he tried to use a gnome settings tool
to switch languages, but that it didn't work, I'm reassigning this bug
to gnome-settings-daemon (at a guess, but that does *seem* to be the
most appropriate).

> Btw. "dpkg-reconfigure locales" might help, and look for the
> localization packages and tasks via APT/aptititude.

Yes, that might help this particular user; but if there is a tool that
claims to be able to do something but isn't, then that is a bug.

I can think of several ways to fix it: the tool could display a helpful
error message when the user selects a language that isn't enabled in
/etc/locale.gen, or it could simply disable all languages not found
there (again, with a helpful message for where to look if a wanted
language isn't in the list), or it could emulate KDE and use a totally
different way of doing language support (though that wouldn't be my
preference), or it could keep it simple and simply display a warning
message above the list of languages to select that languages listed here
must also be enabled through "dpkg-reconfigure locales", or any of a
number of other things.

At any rate, a bug severity of "important" does not seem right to me.

-- 
Copyshops should do vouchers. So that next time some bureaucracy requires you
to mail a form in triplicate, you can mail it just once, add a voucher, and
save on postage.



Bug reopened Request was from Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 07:39:16 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Bug reassigned from package 'general' to 'gnome-settings-daemon'. Request was from Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 07:39:17 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Severity set to 'normal' from 'important' Request was from Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 07:39:17 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Bug reassigned from package 'gnome-settings-daemon' to 'general'. Request was from Josselin Mouette <joss@debian.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:06:05 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, debian-devel@lists.debian.org:
Bug#701585; Package general. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:30:10 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to debian-devel@lists.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:30:10 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #28 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org>
To: control@bugs.debian.org
Cc: 701585@bugs.debian.org, locales@packages.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 19:26:13 +0100
reassign 701585 locales
# or close
thanks

On Dienstag, 26. Februar 2013, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> reassign 701585 general
> thanks
> 
> Le mardi 26 février 2013 à 08:34 +0100, Wouter Verhelst a écrit :
> > No, but the BTS is (to some extent), and there are various tools that
> > suggest the package "general" if you don't know what the exact buggy
> > program is. When doing that, the package ends up on debian-devel.
> > 
> > Since the bug reporter mentioned he tried to use a gnome settings tool
> > to switch languages, but that it didn't work, I'm reassigning this bug
> > to gnome-settings-daemon (at a guess, but that does *seem* to be the
> > most appropriate).
> 
> Thanks for your intervention, but there is nothing that can be done in
> GNOME. The bug is a general design choice in Debian, namely the one to
> not generate all locales but to require a “dpkg-reconfigure locales” to
> add new locales.
 
If it's a design choice, it's not a bug. If it's bad design, it's a bug.
I'll leave the decision to the locales maintainers.

> > > Btw. "dpkg-reconfigure locales" might help, and look for the
> > > localization packages and tasks via APT/aptititude.
> > 
> > Yes, that might help this particular user; but if there is a tool that
> > claims to be able to do something but isn't, then that is a bug.
> 
> The problem is that nobody will have the idea to run this tool.
> 
> > I can think of several ways to fix it: the tool could display a helpful
> > error message when the user selects a language that isn't enabled in
> > /etc/locale.gen, or it could simply disable all languages not found
> > there (again, with a helpful message for where to look if a wanted
> > language isn't in the list)
> 
> That’s what gnome-control-center does. This is not helpful for the user
> who wants to select another language, though.
> 
> The bug is that we do not install locales-all by default, nor do we
> default to generate all (at least all UTF-8) locales.

 
cheers,
	Holger




Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, debian-devel@lists.debian.org:
Bug#701585; Package general. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:30:12 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Christian PERRIER <bubulle@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to debian-devel@lists.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:30:12 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #33 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Christian PERRIER <bubulle@debian.org>
To: 701585@bugs.debian.org, debian-devel@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 19:27:19 +0100
[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]
Quoting Josselin Mouette (joss@debian.org):

> That’s what gnome-control-center does. This is not helpful for the user
> who wants to select another language, though.
> 
> The bug is that we do not install locales-all by default, nor do we
> default to generate all (at least all UTF-8) locales.

At least, we could consider installing locales-all for localized
desktop installs. It's a bit more than 100MB on the hard disk and a
3MB package.

Generating all locales is more debatable, considering the hug CPU time
it would probably require at install time.


[signature.asc (application/pgp-signature, inline)]

Bug reassigned from package 'general' to 'locales'. Request was from Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:30:13 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#701585; Package locales. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:51:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Josselin Mouette <joss@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 18:51:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #40 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Josselin Mouette <joss@debian.org>
To: Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>, 701585@bugs.debian.org
Cc: debian-devel@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 19:03:14 +0100
reassign 701585 general
thanks

Le mardi 26 février 2013 à 08:34 +0100, Wouter Verhelst a écrit :
> No, but the BTS is (to some extent), and there are various tools that
> suggest the package "general" if you don't know what the exact buggy
> program is. When doing that, the package ends up on debian-devel.
> 
> Since the bug reporter mentioned he tried to use a gnome settings tool
> to switch languages, but that it didn't work, I'm reassigning this bug
> to gnome-settings-daemon (at a guess, but that does *seem* to be the
> most appropriate).

Thanks for your intervention, but there is nothing that can be done in
GNOME. The bug is a general design choice in Debian, namely the one to
not generate all locales but to require a “dpkg-reconfigure locales” to
add new locales. 

> > Btw. "dpkg-reconfigure locales" might help, and look for the
> > localization packages and tasks via APT/aptititude.
> 
> Yes, that might help this particular user; but if there is a tool that
> claims to be able to do something but isn't, then that is a bug.

The problem is that nobody will have the idea to run this tool.

> I can think of several ways to fix it: the tool could display a helpful
> error message when the user selects a language that isn't enabled in
> /etc/locale.gen, or it could simply disable all languages not found
> there (again, with a helpful message for where to look if a wanted
> language isn't in the list)

That’s what gnome-control-center does. This is not helpful for the user
who wants to select another language, though.

The bug is that we do not install locales-all by default, nor do we
default to generate all (at least all UTF-8) locales.

Cheers,
-- 
.''`.      Josselin Mouette
: :' :
`. `'
  `-




Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#701585; Package locales. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 21:33:12 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 21:33:12 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #45 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>
To: Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>, 701585@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 22:28:01 +0100
[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]
> Yes, that might help this particular user; but if there is a tool that
> claims to be able to do something but isn't, then that is a bug.
>
> At any rate, a bug severity of "important" does not seem right to me.
>
> --
> Copyshops should do vouchers. So that next time some bureaucracy requires
> you
> to mail a form in triplicate, you can mail it just once, add a voucher, and
> save on postage.
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact
> listmaster@lists.debian.org
> Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130226073458.GA21260@grep.be
>
>
>
[Message part 2 (text/html, inline)]

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#701585; Package locales. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 21:39:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to GNU Libc Maintainers <debian-glibc@lists.debian.org>. (Tue, 26 Feb 2013 21:39:03 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #50 received at 701585@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Carlos Manso <carlos.manso@gmail.com>
To: Wouter Verhelst <wouter@debian.org>, 701585@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Markus Frosch <markus@lazyfrosch.de>, control@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#701585: marked as done (general: Can't select other languages)
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 22:34:28 +0100
[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]
> No, but the BTS is (to some extent), and there are various tools that
> suggest the package "general" if you don't know what the exact buggy
> program is. When doing that, the package ends up on debian-devel.
>
> Since the bug reporter mentioned he tried to use a gnome settings tool
> to switch languages, but that it didn't work, I'm reassigning this bug
> to gnome-settings-daemon (at a guess, but that does *seem* to be the
> most appropriate).
>
>
>>I had this in mind when I submitted the bug. I can fix it by myself,
since I'm more or less a "power user", but after some years gaming on
windows I thought an end-desktop-user(writing documents, email, web)
shouldn't use the shell for anything, so I considered this a bug.

>
>
> At any rate, a bug severity of "important" does not seem right to me.
>
> --
>
>>I chosed the more accurate description I could on the bug-report since I
thought this isn't a "whislist" but a bug.

Sorry if I did something wrong, I'm more or less new to Debian and I only
wanted to help the community since I said before, I could fix this by
myself, as I did.
[Message part 2 (text/html, inline)]

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