Debian Bug report logs - #414412
ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos -- TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

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Message #5 received at submit@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: "Mario Izquierdo \(mariodebian\)" <mariodebian@gmail.com>

To: Debian Bug Tracking System <submit@bugs.debian.org>

Subject: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos -- TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 17:55:52 +0100

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: "Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian)" <mariodebian@gmail.com>


* Package name    : initramfs-tools-tcos
  Version         : 0.67
  Upstream Author : Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian) <mariodebian@gmail.com>
* URL             : http://cls-tcos.forja.rediris.es
* License         : GPL
  Programming Lang: Shell, Python
  Description     : TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

(Include the long description here.)

TCOS is a new thin client implementation based on debian kernel, libs and bins.
The image generation is very simple, TCOS add some hooks to initramfs-tools to 
build a initramfs file with all app that thin client have to use:

dhclient
udev
wireless
discover
ssh server (dropbear)
sound (alsa modules and libs)
pulseaudio (networked sound server better than esound)
vnc server
rdesktop client
Xorg (with a small number of files)

Thin clients with more than 38 Mb of RAM will boot in "PXES mode", downloading 
with tftp the needed files.

Thin clients with less than 38 Mb of RAM will try to mount a NFS server shared 
dir where gentcos has uncompressed initramfs image.
Not complete distro like LTSP do.

This package is NATIVE PACKAGE, because it hard depends on debian 
(or debian based) distro.


This is the first package of other TCOS packages:

* tcosconfig:  TcosConfig is a GUI for gentcos command line
* tcosmonitor: TcosMonitor is a teacher/admin control center to admin 
               a TCOS classroom (similar to Ubuntu Thin Client Manager)

Some info in GFORGE web page:
    http://cls-tcos.forja.rediris.es/


Debian / Ubuntu repository:
    http://cls-tcos.forja.rediris.es/repos

Some info and screenshots (in spanish):
    http://soleup.eup.uva.es/trac


I have uploaded to mentors.debian.net with this result:

It builds these binary packages:
gentcos    - Image generation scripts, and tftp config for TCOS
initramfs-tools-tcos - tools for generating a thin client bootable image: TCOS
tcos       - new thin client implementation
tcos-server-utils - TCOS server utils (gdm autologin or sshfs mount)
tcos-usplash - usplash boot image for TCOS

The package is lintian clean.

The package can be found on mentors.debian.net:
- URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools-tcos
- Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main contrib non-free
- dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools-tcos/initramfs-tools-tcos_0.67.dsc

I would be glad if someone uploaded this package for me.

Kind regards
 Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian)


-- System Information:
Debian Release: 4.0
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (990, 'unstable')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.18-4-k7
Locale: LANG=es_ES.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=es_ES.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)

Message #10 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: Matt Zimmerman <mdz@debian.org>

To: "Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian)" <mariodebian@gmail.com>, 414412@bugs.debian.org

Subject: Re: Bug#414412: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos -- TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 10:27:44 -0700

On Sun, Mar 11, 2007 at 05:55:52PM +0100, Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian) wrote:
> Package: wnpp
> Severity: wishlist
> Owner: "Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian)" <mariodebian@gmail.com>
> 
> 
> * Package name    : initramfs-tools-tcos
>   Version         : 0.67
>   Upstream Author : Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian) <mariodebian@gmail.com>
> * URL             : http://cls-tcos.forja.rediris.es
> * License         : GPL
>   Programming Lang: Shell, Python
>   Description     : TCOS, a debian thin client operating system
> 
> (Include the long description here.)
> 
> TCOS is a new thin client implementation based on debian kernel, libs and bins.
> The image generation is very simple, TCOS add some hooks to initramfs-tools to 
> build a initramfs file with all app that thin client have to use:
> 
> dhclient
> udev
> wireless
> discover
> ssh server (dropbear)
> sound (alsa modules and libs)
> pulseaudio (networked sound server better than esound)
> vnc server
> rdesktop client
> Xorg (with a small number of files)
> 
> Thin clients with more than 38 Mb of RAM will boot in "PXES mode", downloading 
> with tftp the needed files.
> 
> Thin clients with less than 38 Mb of RAM will try to mount a NFS server shared 
> dir where gentcos has uncompressed initramfs image.
> Not complete distro like LTSP do.

What is the difference relative to LTSP?  Is it that it runs directly from
the initramfs where there is enough RAM?

If so, wouldn't this be better added as a feature to LTSP rather than a new
thin client implementation?  I thought about adding it at one point, but
didn't have a need for it yet.

-- 
 - mdz

Message #15 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: mariodebian <mariodebian@gmail.com>

To: Matt Zimmerman <mdz@debian.org>

Cc: 414412@bugs.debian.org

Subject: Re: Bug#414412: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos -- TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 19:00:26 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

El dom, 11-03-2007 a las 10:27 -0700, Matt Zimmerman escribió:
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2007 at 05:55:52PM +0100, Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian) wrote:
> > Package: wnpp
> > Severity: wishlist
> > Owner: "Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian)" <mariodebian@gmail.com>
> > 
> > 
> > * Package name    : initramfs-tools-tcos
> >   Version         : 0.67
> >   Upstream Author : Mario Izquierdo (mariodebian) <mariodebian@gmail.com>
> > * URL             : http://cls-tcos.forja.rediris.es
> > * License         : GPL
> >   Programming Lang: Shell, Python
> >   Description     : TCOS, a debian thin client operating system
> > 
> > (Include the long description here.)
> > 
> > TCOS is a new thin client implementation based on debian kernel, libs and bins.
> > The image generation is very simple, TCOS add some hooks to initramfs-tools to 
> > build a initramfs file with all app that thin client have to use:
> > 
> > dhclient
> > udev
> > wireless
> > discover
> > ssh server (dropbear)
> > sound (alsa modules and libs)
> > pulseaudio (networked sound server better than esound)
> > vnc server
> > rdesktop client
> > Xorg (with a small number of files)
> > 
> > Thin clients with more than 38 Mb of RAM will boot in "PXES mode", downloading 
> > with tftp the needed files.
> > 
> > Thin clients with less than 38 Mb of RAM will try to mount a NFS server shared 
> > dir where gentcos has uncompressed initramfs image.
> > Not complete distro like LTSP do.
> 
> What is the difference relative to LTSP?  Is it that it runs directly from
> the initramfs where there is enough RAM?
> 
> If so, wouldn't this be better added as a feature to LTSP rather than a new
> thin client implementation?  I thought about adding it at one point, but
> didn't have a need for it yet.
> 

LTSP 4.2 patch and compile kernel and packages specially for using in
thin clients.

LTSP 5.0 uses a chroot (Muekow ??) and install a debian/ubuntu with
debotstrap.

In LTSP 4.2 and LTSP 5.0, NFS server is required and nowadays with thin
clients with more RAM it isn't necesary.

I think that LTSP is a very big project and will be very difficult to
make TCOS as LTSP feature. In other hand I have tried a lot of times to
show my project to them but nobody ear my.

With TCOS I build a small initramfs (5 Mb) and usr-x.x.x.squashfs
(10-15Mb) (where some of utils are: Xorg, etc...).

With 38 Mb aprox of RAM thin client don't need swap, with 32 can use
hard disk swap automatically.

Requirement are higher that LTSP or PXES because thin clients are
running normal Xorg 7.1 and normal kernel 2.6.18-486 (for example)

We are using Pentium 350 with 64Mb with 24h/365d uptime without
problems.

TCOS don't modify any debian package, only copy binaries and dep libs
(ldd based) into initramfs or external squashfs.

Thin client while booting download usr.squashfs and don't need NFS.

TCOS has more utils like a XMLRPC server to make a dialog between server
and thin clients, a GUI Monitor to control all hosts and a GUI (similar
to pxeconfig) to create images.



All GUI utils use gettext and are translated in english and spanish.

SVN repos:
  https://forja.rediris.es/svn/cls-tcos/trunk/

Screenshots of GUI utils:
  http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TCOS-config/es
  http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TcosMonitor/Screenshots
  http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TcosVolumeManager

Spanish Debian/ubuntu based distros (Guadalinex, Linex, Molinux..) are
working to put TCOS in their repos to create terminal servers very easy.

We are using in a production environment (Free access room of
University) since October 2006, and we are installing in a lot of
schools in our city.

TCOS was presented last year to Google SOC and not was selected.



Matt, thanks for your attention, and excuse my english.

-- 
http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mariodebian

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Message #20 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: Matt Zimmerman <mdz@debian.org>

To: mariodebian <mariodebian@gmail.com>

Cc: 414412@bugs.debian.org, Oliver Grawert <ogra@ubuntu.com>

Subject: Re: Bug#414412: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos -- TCOS, a debian thin client operating system

Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 11:19:22 -0700

On Sun, Mar 11, 2007 at 07:00:26PM +0100, mariodebian wrote:
> El dom, 11-03-2007 a las 10:27 -0700, Matt Zimmerman escribió:
> > What is the difference relative to LTSP?  Is it that it runs directly from
> > the initramfs where there is enough RAM?
> > 
> > If so, wouldn't this be better added as a feature to LTSP rather than a new
> > thin client implementation?  I thought about adding it at one point, but
> > didn't have a need for it yet.
> > 
> 
> LTSP 4.2 patch and compile kernel and packages specially for using in
> thin clients.
> 
> LTSP 5.0 uses a chroot (Muekow ??) and install a debian/ubuntu with
> debotstrap.

Yes, I know; I wrote the initial implementation.  It's not a complete
install, but a basic one which includes X.

> In LTSP 4.2 and LTSP 5.0, NFS server is required and nowadays with thin
> clients with more RAM it isn't necesary.

Indeed, this is why I think it would be interesting to have the capability
to bypass NFS in LTSP as well.

> I think that LTSP is a very big project and will be very difficult to
> make TCOS as LTSP feature. In other hand I have tried a lot of times to
> show my project to them but nobody ear my.

Perhaps if your project were submitted in the form of a patch to LTSP,
rather than an alternative implementation, it would be better received.  It
sounds like it could be built as an incremental step on top of the existing
chroot build process.

As I mentioned, I realized this possibility while I was working on it, but
had no need to implement the feature at the time.  It would be a fine
addition, though.

I'm CCing Oliver Grawert, who is actively working on the mainline branch of
LTSP and should be able to answer your questions about this.

> With TCOS I build a small initramfs (5 Mb) and usr-x.x.x.squashfs
> (10-15Mb) (where some of utils are: Xorg, etc...).
> 
> With 38 Mb aprox of RAM thin client don't need swap, with 32 can use
> hard disk swap automatically.
> 
> Requirement are higher that LTSP or PXES because thin clients are
> running normal Xorg 7.1 and normal kernel 2.6.18-486 (for example)

LTSP (5.x) uses standard X and kernels as well.

> We are using Pentium 350 with 64Mb with 24h/365d uptime without
> problems.
> 
> TCOS don't modify any debian package, only copy binaries and dep libs
> (ldd based) into initramfs or external squashfs.
> 
> Thin client while booting download usr.squashfs and don't need NFS.
> 
> TCOS has more utils like a XMLRPC server to make a dialog between server
> and thin clients, a GUI Monitor to control all hosts and a GUI (similar
> to pxeconfig) to create images.

These tools sound interesting; I expect they could be used with LTSP as
well.

> 
> 
> 
> All GUI utils use gettext and are translated in english and spanish.
> 
> SVN repos:
>   https://forja.rediris.es/svn/cls-tcos/trunk/
> 
> Screenshots of GUI utils:
>   http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TCOS-config/es
>   http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TcosMonitor/Screenshots
>   http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mediawiki/index.php/TcosVolumeManager
> 
> Spanish Debian/ubuntu based distros (Guadalinex, Linex, Molinux..) are
> working to put TCOS in their repos to create terminal servers very easy.
> 
> We are using in a production environment (Free access room of
> University) since October 2006, and we are installing in a lot of
> schools in our city.
> 
> TCOS was presented last year to Google SOC and not was selected.
> 
> 
> 
> Matt, thanks for your attention, and excuse my english.
> 
> -- 
> http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mariodebian



-- 
 - mdz

Message #25 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: Bart Martens <bartm@debian.org>

To: 414412@bugs.debian.org

Subject: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos

Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:48:51 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

Hello Mario,

http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=414412
http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools-tcos/

Could you have a look at the debian/copyright file please ? It seems
incomplete when comparing with the template in dh-make.

Regards,

Bart Martens

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Message #30 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: mariodebian <mariodebian@gmail.com>

To: Bart Martens <bartm@debian.org>, 414412@bugs.debian.org

Subject: Re: Bug#414412: ITP: initramfs-tools-tcos

Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:42:38 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

El mar, 27-11-2007 a las 14:48 +0100, Bart Martens escribió:
> Hello Mario,
> 
> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=414412
> http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools-tcos/
> 
> Could you have a look at the debian/copyright file please ? It seems
> incomplete when comparing with the template in dh-make.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Bart Martens
> 

Hi Bart 

Mentors code is quite old.


Please download from here:

deb-src http://www.tcosproject.org unstable main

or

http://www.tcosproject.org/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools-tcos/

initramfs-tools-tcos need other packages:

tinylogin
tcosconfig
tcosmonitor
etherboot-tcos

I have to change some depends (like ltspfs-* packages and use official
LTSP Debian packages)

Thanks for trying to package

Greetings
-- 
http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mariodebian

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Message #35 received at 414412@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: mariodebian <mariodebian@gmail.com>

To: 414412@bugs.debian.org

Subject: Working again on this ITP

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 2009 02:02:43 +0200

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

I'm working again on this ITP.

I have uploaded some depends:

  * python-netifaces
  * p910nd

I'm waiting these bugs (not critical for TCOS):

  * #523034
  * #454478 (fixed in NEW)

Roadmap:

   http://wiki.tcosproject.org/Tcos_Into_Debian

GIT:
http://tcosproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/initramfs-tools-tcos.git/log/?h=tcosdebian
"tcosdebian" branch should be used as initial upload (with more fixes)


Cheers
-- 
http://soleup.eup.uva.es/mariodebian

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Message #40 received at 414412-done@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):

From: mariodebian <mariodebian@gmail.com>

To: 414412-done@bugs.debian.org

Subject: The package is renamew to tcos

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:17:33 +0200

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

initramfs-tools-package is renamed to tcos.

I will create another ITP with correct package description and new VCS
urls.






-- 
Saludos
--
http://mariodebian.com

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