Debian Bug report logs - #385665
fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function

Package: tech-ctte; Maintainer for tech-ctte is Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>;

Reported by: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>

Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2006 00:33:07 UTC

Severity: serious

Done: Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>

Bug is archived. No further changes may be made.

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Report forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>:
New Bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #5 received at submit@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
To: Debian Bug Tracking System <submit@bugs.debian.org>
Subject: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Sat, 02 Sep 2006 02:06:39 +0200
Package: libfluidsynth1
Version: 1.0.7a-1
Severity: serious

fluidsynth seems to need a non-free (non-distributable) midi sample
bank to function properly.  I therefore think it belongs in contrib,
rather than non-free, and it shoudl have proper documentation on where
to get the sound bank.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.17.8
Locale: LANG=en_GB.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_GB.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)

Versions of packages libfluidsynth1 depends on:
ii  ladcca2                      0.4.0-6     LADCCA shared library files
pn  libasound2                   <none>      (no description available)
ii  libc6                        2.3.6.ds1-4 GNU C Library: Shared libraries
ii  libjack0.100.0-0             0.101.1-1   JACK Audio Connection Kit (librari
ii  libncurses5                  5.5-2       Shared libraries for terminal hand
ii  libreadline5                 5.1-7       GNU readline and history libraries
ii  libuuid1                     1.39-1      universally unique id library

libfluidsynth1 recommends no packages.

-- no debconf information



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #10 received at submit@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Debian Bug Tracking System <submit@bugs.debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2006 23:58:37 +0200
On Sat, Sep 02, 2006 at 02:06:39AM +0200, Bas Zoetekouw wrote:
> Package: libfluidsynth1
> Version: 1.0.7a-1
> Severity: serious
> 
> fluidsynth seems to need a non-free (non-distributable) midi sample
> bank to function properly.  I therefore think it belongs in contrib,
> rather than non-free, and it shoudl have proper documentation on where
> to get the sound bank.

Hi,

Thanks for your report.

I'm not sure I understand you completely. What bank are you referring 
to ?

Regards,

Eric.

-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #20 received at submit@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org, Debian Bug Tracking System <submit@bugs.debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Sun, 3 Sep 2006 12:22:39 +0200
Hi Eric!

You wrote:

> > fluidsynth seems to need a non-free (non-distributable) midi sample
> > bank to function properly.  I therefore think it belongs in contrib,
> > rather than non-free, and it shoudl have proper documentation on where
> > to get the sound bank.

> I'm not sure I understand you completely. What bank are you referring 
> to ?

A collection of samples, which one needs to actually play midi files.
One that seems to work is the file "8MBGMSFX.SF2" from the SoundBlaster
windows drivers, but that one is of course non-free.  There are no free
sample banks in SF2 format that I'm aware of.

I haven't tried if fluidsynth works with the GUS-compatible samples from
the freepats package;  if it does, it should probably depend on that
package, but if it does not, it should move to contrib.

Regards,
Bas.

-- 
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Bas Zoetekouw              | GPG key: 0644fab7                     |
|----------------------------| Fingerprint: c1f5 f24c d514 3fec 8bf6 |
| bas@o2w.nl, bas@debian.org |              a2b1 2bae e41f 0644 fab7 |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+ 



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #30 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 00:23:18 +0200
On Sun, Sep 03, 2006 at 12:22:39PM +0200, Bas Zoetekouw wrote:
> Hi Eric!
> 
> You wrote:
> 
> > > fluidsynth seems to need a non-free (non-distributable) midi sample
> > > bank to function properly.  I therefore think it belongs in contrib,
> > > rather than non-free, and it shoudl have proper documentation on where
> > > to get the sound bank.
> 
> > I'm not sure I understand you completely. What bank are you referring 
> > to ?
> 
> A collection of samples, which one needs to actually play midi files.
> One that seems to work is the file "8MBGMSFX.SF2" from the SoundBlaster
> windows drivers, but that one is of course non-free.  There are no free
> sample banks in SF2 format that I'm aware of.

If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
don't exist...

Anyway the SF2 format itself isn't patented, so you can always create 
your own sound banks. There are free apps that let you do that, say 
swami.

Whether or not the sound banks you find on internet are copyrighted 
isn't related in any way with the dependencies of the fluidsynth 
package.

If you want to do a parallel, we could talk about xpdf package, and 
you'd say "hey all texts in pdf I find on the internet are 
copyrighted, so xpdf should move to non-free". This doesn't make much 
sense, does it ?

If you agree with me, I think you could close this bug.

Regards,

E.

-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #35 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 00:43:56 +0200
Hi Eric!

You wrote:

> If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
> don't exist...
> Anyway the SF2 format itself isn't patented, so you can always create 
> your own sound banks. There are free apps that let you do that, say 
> swami.

It doesn't matter.  The only thing that matters is that no usable sample
bank is available in main.  Therefore, fluidsynth needs stuff from
uitside main (be it non-free, my soundblaster cd, or the internet) to
function, and therefore belongs in contrib.

> Whether or not the sound banks you find on internet are copyrighted 
> isn't related in any way with the dependencies of the fluidsynth 
> package.

Surely it is.  Fluidsynth is non-functional without the sample bank.

> If you agree with me, I think you could close this bug.

I most certainly do not agree.

-- 
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Bas Zoetekouw              | GPG key: 0644fab7                     |
|----------------------------| Fingerprint: c1f5 f24c d514 3fec 8bf6 |
| bas@o2w.nl, bas@debian.org |              a2b1 2bae e41f 0644 fab7 |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+ 



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #40 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be
Cc: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2006 21:51:35 +0200
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 12:23:18AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
> don't exist...

This is not the way it works.

Are there any free sample banks in _Debian main_, usable by fluidsynth? In
that case, please close this bug.

Are there none in main, but available on the Internet or otherwise? In that
case, please package at least one of them (in main!) and depend on it.

If not, please move the package to contrib. You cannot have a package in main
that needs anything outside main to work properly. (For your xpdf example,
there are several free PDFs available in main.)

/* Steinar */
-- 
Homepage: http://www.sesse.net/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #45 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:36:34 +0200
On Fri, Sep 15, 2006 at 09:51:35PM +0200, Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 12:23:18AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> > If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
> > don't exist...
> 
> This is not the way it works.

IMHO it is the way it works.

> 
> Are there any free sample banks in _Debian main_, usable by fluidsynth? In
> that case, please close this bug.

You can create your own sound fonts with swami for example. FYI, swami 
is a sound bank editor and AFAICT, swami doesn't depend on any sound 
bank package either.

> 
> Are there none in main, but available on the Internet or otherwise? In that
> case, please package at least one of them (in main!) and depend on it.

I won't, but feel free to do so if you'd like to see one in Debian. I 
don't know if you're a DD, if not I'd be glad to sponsor your package.

> 
> If not, please move the package to contrib. You cannot have a package in main
> that needs anything outside main to work properly. (For your xpdf example,
> there are several free PDFs available in main.)

xpdf-reader doesn't depend on any package providing pdf files.


Maybe you could elaborate on some Debian policy paragraph to justify 
your query ?

Greetings,

-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #50 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org, Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 03:05:59 +0200
On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 06:36:34PM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
>>> If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
>>> don't exist...
>> This is not the way it works.
> IMHO it is the way it works.

I'm sorry, but it's not. Debian policy, section 2.2.1:

  [...] the packages in _main_
   * must not require a package outside of _main_ for compilation or
     execution (thus, the package must not declare a "Depends", "Recommends",
     or "Build-Depends" relationship on a non-_main_ package),

Unless you really want to split hairs, I'd say it's reasonable to say that
fluidsynth requires an external synth bank for execution. There's no such
thing in main, thus it can't go into main.

There have been multiple analogous cases to fluidsynth; Doom was for instance
in contrib for several years since there was no packaged free WAD, and Quake
II and openduke are still in that situation. ZSNES is in contrib because
there are no packages of free SNES ROMs, nestra likewise, etc. etc. etc. --
you could probably find dozens of similar examples if you just look. Just
saying “well, you can use it with free data, and you can't prove that there's
no free data out there” doesn't really cut it.

> You can create your own sound fonts with swami for example. 

That doesn't help.

> FYI, swami is a sound bank editor and AFAICT, swami doesn't depend on any
> sound bank package either.

That's good for swami (so it can rightfully go into main), but it does not
help fluidsynth any.

>> Are there none in main, but available on the Internet or otherwise? In that
>> case, please package at least one of them (in main!) and depend on it.
> I won't,

Then your package must go into contrib, sorry.

> don't know if you're a DD, if not I'd be glad to sponsor your package.

I am a DD. I definitely won't create such a package, though. :-)

/* Steinar */
-- 
Homepage: http://www.sesse.net/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #55 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sgunderson@bigfoot.com>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2006 11:27:10 +0200
On Tue, Sep 19, 2006 at 03:05:59AM +0200, Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 06:36:34PM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> >>> If you aren't aware of any free sample bank, this doesn't mean they 
> >>> don't exist...
> >> This is not the way it works.
> > IMHO it is the way it works.
> 
> I'm sorry, but it's not. Debian policy, section 2.2.1:
> 
>   [...] the packages in _main_
>    * must not require a package outside of _main_ for compilation or
>      execution (thus, the package must not declare a "Depends", "Recommends",
>      or "Build-Depends" relationship on a non-_main_ package),
> 
> Unless you really want to split hairs, I'd say it's reasonable to say that
> fluidsynth requires an external synth bank for execution. There's no such
> thing in main, thus it can't go into main.

Swami for example uses fluidsynth as its synthesizer engine and works 
perfectly without external sound banks.


We definitely disagree on this matter. Feel free to raise the question 
to the Technical Committee and I'll follow their recommendation 
whatever it might be.

Regards,

-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package libfluidsynth1. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sesse@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #60 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sesse@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org, Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>, control@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2006 23:46:17 +0200
reassign 385665 tech-ctte
thanks

On Wed, Sep 20, 2006 at 11:27:10AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> Swami for example uses fluidsynth as its synthesizer engine and works 
> perfectly without external sound banks.

That's new information to me; that would definitely be a case to keep
libfluidsynth1 in main, IMNSHO fluidsynth still has to go into contrib.

> We definitely disagree on this matter. Feel free to raise the question 
> to the Technical Committee and I'll follow their recommendation 
> whatever it might be.

That sounds reasonable, especially as they're already discussing ndiswrapper,
which is at least related. Reassigning.

/* Steinar */
-- 
Homepage: http://www.sesse.net/



Bug reassigned from package `libfluidsynth1' to `tech-ctte'. Request was from "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sesse@debian.org> to control@bugs.debian.org. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #67 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, "Steinar H. Gunderson" <sesse@debian.org>
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 22:45:42 -0700
Eric,

On Wed, Sep 20, 2006 at 11:46:17PM +0200, Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 20, 2006 at 11:27:10AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> > Swami for example uses fluidsynth as its synthesizer engine and works 
> > perfectly without external sound banks.

> That's new information to me; that would definitely be a case to keep
> libfluidsynth1 in main, IMNSHO fluidsynth still has to go into contrib.

If swami is really able to make use of fluidsynth without the need for any
external sound banks, then this would seem to be a cut-and-dried case.  Can
you please step me through how I would do that?  I can't see anywhere that
swami lets me create sound fonts from scratch, and I don't see any
documentation within the app about what format a sample needs to be in for
me to import it?

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #72 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 02:32:38 +0200
Hi Guenter,

I hope you're fine, it's been a long time since we met in Barcelona, 
years ago... Are you still there ?

I'm dealing with bug #385665 and your help would be greatly 
appreciated.

Someon is requesting to move fluidsynth from main/ to contrib/ arguing 
that 'fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function'. The 
argument really is that there aren't free SF2 files available out 
there. I could found lots of them but it wasn't sufficient apparently.
I desperately tried to demonstrate that in any case the sound banks 
you use with fluidsynth may be copyrighted or not and this shouldn't 
make fluidsynth depend on free/non-free packages...

Anyway, I have one question that could solve the problem quickly: is 
it possible to create SF2 files with swami from scratch ? Just a plain 
sine wave ?

Thanks,

Eric.


----- Forwarded message from Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org> -----

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be,
	"Steinar H. Gunderson" <sesse@debian.org>
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2006 22:45:42 -0700
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org

Eric,

On Wed, Sep 20, 2006 at 11:46:17PM +0200, Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 20, 2006 at 11:27:10AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> > Swami for example uses fluidsynth as its synthesizer engine and works 
> > perfectly without external sound banks.

> That's new information to me; that would definitely be a case to keep
> libfluidsynth1 in main, IMNSHO fluidsynth still has to go into contrib.

If swami is really able to make use of fluidsynth without the need for any
external sound banks, then this would seem to be a cut-and-dried case.  Can
you please step me through how I would do that?  I can't see anywhere that
swami lets me create sound fonts from scratch, and I don't see any
documentation within the app about what format a sample needs to be in for
me to import it?

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/

----- End forwarded message -----

-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #77 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 03:05:17 -0700
Eric,

On Tue, Sep 26, 2006 at 02:32:38AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:

> I hope you're fine, it's been a long time since we met in Barcelona, 
> years ago... Are you still there ?

> I'm dealing with bug #385665 and your help would be greatly 
> appreciated.

> Someon is requesting to move fluidsynth from main/ to contrib/ arguing 
> that 'fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function'. The 
> argument really is that there aren't free SF2 files available out 
> there. I could found lots of them but it wasn't sufficient apparently.

Sorry, are you saying that you *did* finds lots of free SF2 files?  This
information isn't in the bug report.  If there are freely available SF2
files, can you please point us to one?

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #82 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 14:28:45 +0200
On Tue, Sep 26, 2006 at 03:05:17AM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> Eric,
> 
> On Tue, Sep 26, 2006 at 02:32:38AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> 
> > I hope you're fine, it's been a long time since we met in Barcelona, 
> > years ago... Are you still there ?
> 
> > I'm dealing with bug #385665 and your help would be greatly 
> > appreciated.
> 
> > Someon is requesting to move fluidsynth from main/ to contrib/ arguing 
> > that 'fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function'. The 
> > argument really is that there aren't free SF2 files available out 
> > there. I could found lots of them but it wasn't sufficient apparently.
> 
> Sorry, are you saying that you *did* finds lots of free SF2 files?  This
> information isn't in the bug report.  If there are freely available SF2
> files, can you please point us to one?

Sorry for the tone of the message. There are lots of sf2 files 
available for example at:

http://hammersound.net/cgi-bin/soundlink.pl

or at

http://www.sf2midi.com/index.php?searchword=&filetype=sf2&typesearch=files&page=search


-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to geiger <geiger@xdv.org>:
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Message #87 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: geiger <geiger@xdv.org>
To: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Cc: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 16:33:34 +0200 (CEST)
On Tue, 26 Sep 2006, Steve Langasek wrote:
> Eric,
>
> On Tue, Sep 26, 2006 at 02:32:38AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
>
> > I hope you're fine, it's been a long time since we met in Barcelona,
> > years ago... Are you still there ?
>
> > I'm dealing with bug #385665 and your help would be greatly
> > appreciated.
>
> > Someon is requesting to move fluidsynth from main/ to contrib/ arguing
> > that 'fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function'. The
> > argument really is that there aren't free SF2 files available out
> > there. I could found lots of them but it wasn't sufficient apparently.
>
> Sorry, are you saying that you *did* finds lots of free SF2 files?  This
> information isn't in the bug report.  If there are freely available SF2
> files, can you please point us to one?

Hi Eric and Steve,

I have read through the bug-report and I have to admit that I am
surprised. Swami is a soundfile editor and therefore it can be
used to generate soundfonts, so in Steve's word a "cut-and-dried"
case.

There are free soundfonts out there, e.g.

http://www.sseyo.com/showcase/demos/soundfonts.html

but I have no idea what free means to sseyo.

There are also soundfonts at freepats:
http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/rhodes/, for example.

I don't have time to check for licenses, but instead of trying
to move fluidsynth into contrib it might be worth to talk about how to
include some soundfonts in Debian.

I think this bug has no justification and should be closed.

Günter



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
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Message #92 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, geiger <geiger@xdv.org>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 11:37:39 -0700
Hi Guenter,

On Tue, Sep 26, 2006 at 04:33:34PM +0200, geiger wrote:

> I have read through the bug-report and I have to admit that I am
> surprised. Swami is a soundfile editor and therefore it can be
> used to generate soundfonts, so in Steve's word a "cut-and-dried"
> case.

For my own edification, could you please explain how I would create a sound
font in swami?  I could only find options to import existing sound fonts.

> There are also soundfonts at freepats:
> http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/rhodes/, for example.

And freepats is also packaged, so if it's compatible, I see no reason why
fluidsynth should be regarded as inappropriate for main (or even buggy, if
it can also be used with swami to create new fonts).

Do any of the other TC members disagree?  If not, I'll draft a quick
resolution upholding the maintainer's decision and then we can get back to
arguing about ndiswrapper :-)

-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to geiger <geiger@xdv.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #97 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: geiger <geiger@xdv.org>
To: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Cc: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2006 19:35:35 +0200 (CEST)
On Tue, 26 Sep 2006, Steve Langasek wrote:
> For my own edification, could you please explain how I would create a sound
> font in swami?  I could only find options to import existing sound fonts.

Hi,

You can create new soundfonts with file->new within swami.

> > There are also soundfonts at freepats:
> > http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/rhodes/, for example.
>
> And freepats is also packaged, so if it's compatible, I see no reason why
> fluidsynth should be regarded as inappropriate for main (or even buggy, if
> it can also be used with swami to create new fonts).
>

Me neither, but there is definitely a lack of good, free soundfonts.
I don't think that moving fluidsynth to contrib and
therefore removing part of the tools to make soundfonts would help the
cause.

The freepats as distributed in Debian are not compatible with fluidsynth,
so what remains to be done is to package the soundfonts from the freepats
site and clear their licenses (which I fear is not that easy).

> Do any of the other TC members disagree?  If not, I'll draft a quick
> resolution upholding the maintainer's decision and then we can get back to
> arguing about ndiswrapper :-)

Yes :)

Guenter



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #102 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: geiger <geiger@xdv.org>, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2006 15:02:37 -0700
On Wed, Sep 27, 2006 at 07:35:35PM +0200, geiger wrote:

> On Tue, 26 Sep 2006, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > For my own edification, could you please explain how I would create a sound
> > font in swami?  I could only find options to import existing sound fonts.

> You can create new soundfonts with file->new within swami.

Well, that part I've got.  How do I put *sound* into it? :)  I would assume
that I need to 'load samples', but the UI doesn't provide much guidance
concerning the format these samples should be in... ah, here we go, it was a
file dialog problem.

So yes, I can confirm that I'm able to create soundfonts loading arbitrary
.wav samples from disk.  But is this the part that uses fluidsynth?  That's
not clear to me.  All of the "Load Wavetable" menu items in the UI do
nothing when I click them, for instance, so I'm not sure if fluidsynth is
what's being used for the sound output here?

> > > There are also soundfonts at freepats:
> > > http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/rhodes/, for example.

> > And freepats is also packaged, so if it's compatible, I see no reason why
> > fluidsynth should be regarded as inappropriate for main (or even buggy, if
> > it can also be used with swami to create new fonts).

> Me neither, but there is definitely a lack of good, free soundfonts.
> I don't think that moving fluidsynth to contrib and
> therefore removing part of the tools to make soundfonts would help the
> cause.

> The freepats as distributed in Debian are not compatible with fluidsynth,
> so what remains to be done is to package the soundfonts from the freepats
> site and clear their licenses (which I fear is not that easy).

Ok, in that case the best chance of clearing this up quickly is still to
show that swami is useful for authoring sound fonts and that fluidsynth
plays a role in this.

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #107 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Van Buggenhaut <ericvb@debian.org>
To: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2006 01:11:46 +0200
On Wed, Sep 27, 2006 at 03:02:37PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 27, 2006 at 07:35:35PM +0200, geiger wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 26 Sep 2006, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > > For my own edification, could you please explain how I would create a sound
> > > font in swami?  I could only find options to import existing sound fonts.
> 
> > You can create new soundfonts with file->new within swami.
> 
> Well, that part I've got.  How do I put *sound* into it? :)  I would assume
> that I need to 'load samples', but the UI doesn't provide much guidance
> concerning the format these samples should be in... ah, here we go, it was a
> file dialog problem.
> 
> So yes, I can confirm that I'm able to create soundfonts loading arbitrary
> .wav samples from disk.  But is this the part that uses fluidsynth?  That's
> not clear to me.  All of the "Load Wavetable" menu items in the UI do
> nothing when I click them, for instance, so I'm not sure if fluidsynth is
> what's being used for the sound output here?
> 
> > > > There are also soundfonts at freepats:
> > > > http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/rhodes/, for example.
> 
> > > And freepats is also packaged, so if it's compatible, I see no reason why
> > > fluidsynth should be regarded as inappropriate for main (or even buggy, if
> > > it can also be used with swami to create new fonts).
> 
> > Me neither, but there is definitely a lack of good, free soundfonts.
> > I don't think that moving fluidsynth to contrib and
> > therefore removing part of the tools to make soundfonts would help the
> > cause.
> 
> > The freepats as distributed in Debian are not compatible with fluidsynth,
> > so what remains to be done is to package the soundfonts from the freepats
> > site and clear their licenses (which I fear is not that easy).
> 
> Ok, in that case the best chance of clearing this up quickly is still to
> show that swami is useful for authoring sound fonts and that fluidsynth
> plays a role in this.

Whether or not fluidsynth plays a role there isn't that relevant.

The bug report is about whether there are free sound fonts available 
to use with fluidsynth. As soon as we discover that the user can 
create his own sound fonts, it becomes pointless to state that 
fluidsynth depends on non-free sound fonts.


-- 
Eric VAN BUGGENHAUT
ericvb@debian.org



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #112 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2006 01:16:54 -0700
On Thu, Sep 28, 2006 at 01:11:46AM +0200, Eric Van Buggenhaut wrote:
> > Ok, in that case the best chance of clearing this up quickly is still to
> > show that swami is useful for authoring sound fonts and that fluidsynth
> > plays a role in this.

> Whether or not fluidsynth plays a role there isn't that relevant.

> The bug report is about whether there are free sound fonts available 
> to use with fluidsynth. As soon as we discover that the user can 
> create his own sound fonts, it becomes pointless to state that 
> fluidsynth depends on non-free sound fonts.

If I am to argue this position to the other members of the Technical
Committee, I would like to be able to prove to myself not just that swami
can be used to author soundfonts for use with fluidsynth, but that
fluidsynth is used by swami *in the process* of authoring these soundfonts.
If hitting those piano keys to test my one-sample soundfont is in fact
running them through fluidsynth, then I'm content to call this a significant
free use of fluidsynth.

If, OTOH, what I've done so far didn't make use of fluidsynth, I'm not
content with the explanation that one *can* use swami to create soundfonts
when so far I haven't created anything by this method that's worth using. :)

So I think I need either a bit more handholding with swami to create a
minimally useful soundfont, or I need confirmation that fluidsynth is being
used in the authoring process with swami, to be happy recommending an
immediate vote here.  Otherwise, we wander into twisty questions of what a
"dependency" is, like we have already for ndiswrapper.

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #117 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
To: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2006 01:27:57 -0700
Oh, a follow-up comment:

I do agree that the analogy with a pdf viewer and a web browser is a
perfectly adequate one, but we do have to consider what this analogy means.
A PDF viewer and a web browser are IMHO acceptable for main not just because
we include free PDFs and html pages in the archive, but also because our
users create content in these formats using free tools and will want to view
the results.  Indeed, I've trivially created PDFs and html documents many
times... but I've never created a sound font before, which is why I want to
ascertain that it's within my ability to create a useful sound font using
the available tools before signing off on this theory for fluidsynth's
inclusion in main.

Thanks,
-- 
Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org                                   http://www.debian.org/



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to geiger <geiger@xdv.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #122 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: geiger <geiger@xdv.org>
To: Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org>
Cc: Eric.VanBuggenhaut@AdValvas.be, 385665@bugs.debian.org, Guenter Geiger <geiger@debian.org>
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Fwd: Re: Bug#385665: fluidsynth needs non-free midi sound bank to function (Sat, Sep 23, 2006 at 10:45 -0700)
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2006 11:23:24 +0200 (CEST)
On Thu, 28 Sep 2006, Steve Langasek wrote
> If I am to argue this position to the other members of the Technical
> Committee, I would like to be able to prove to myself not just that swami
> can be used to author soundfonts for use with fluidsynth, but that
> fluidsynth is used by swami *in the process* of authoring these soundfonts.
> If hitting those piano keys to test my one-sample soundfont is in fact
> running them through fluidsynth, then I'm content to call this a significant
> free use of fluidsynth.

swami depends on libfluidsynth which is part of the fluidsynth source
package.

>
> If, OTOH, what I've done so far didn't make use of fluidsynth, I'm not
> content with the explanation that one *can* use swami to create soundfonts
> when so far I haven't created anything by this method that's worth using. :)

Yeah, same problem here with a program called gcc :)

No honestly, lets look at it from another point of view, why should
fluidsynth go into contrib when

1) there are free soundfonts available
e.g. see http://freepats.opensrc.org/sf2/violin/ for one with a very clear
licensing

2) You can create soundfonts with swami

3) You need fluidsynth in order to play your soundfonts and use them
with a sequencer.

I might not be up to date with the policies regarding contrib, but to
me this case is so clear that I am starting to get a bit impatient.

Please explain why fluidsynth should go into contrib, because
I really don't get it.

Günter

PS: if your interested in how to create soundfonts, I took notes while
creating one http://gige.xdv.org/swami.txt



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>, 385665@bugs.debian.org:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #127 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>
To: debian-ctte@lists.debian.org
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 10:18:49 -0600
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I hereby call for an immediate TC vote on the question of whether fluidsynth 
should be moved to contrib, requested by bug #385665.  

The BTS seems to me to have a sufficiently thorough discussion of this issue
to enable a vote.  Since this vote may overrule a developer, 6.1.3 of our 
Constitution requires a 3:1 majority of the TC for choice 1.

  In the brackets next to your preferred choice, place a 1. Place a 2 in
  the brackets next to your next choice.  Continue until you reach your last
  choice.  Do not enter a number smaller than 1 or larger than 3.  You may
  skip numbers.  You may rank options equally (as long as all choices X you
  make fall in the range 1 <= X <= 3).

  To vote "no, no matter what" rank "Further discussion" as more
  desirable than the unacceptable choices, or You may rank the "Further
  discussion" choice, and leave choices you consider unacceptable
  blank. Unranked choices are considered equally the least desired
  choices, and ranked below all ranked choices. (Note: if the Further
  Discussion choice is unranked, then it is equal to all other unranked
  choices, if any.)

- - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
[   ] Choice 1: fluidsynth should move to contrib as per bug #385665
[   ] Choice 2: fluidsynth should remain in main despite bug #385665
[   ] Choice 3: Further discussion
- - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Bdale
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Comment: Processed by Mailcrypt 3.5.8+ <http://mailcrypt.sourceforge.net/>

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-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Ian Jackson <ian@davenant.greenend.org.uk>:
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Message #132 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Ian Jackson <ian@davenant.greenend.org.uk>
To: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Cc: debian-ctte@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 17:30:49 +0100
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Bdale Garbee writes ("Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib"):
> - - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> [ 3 ] Choice 1: fluidsynth should move to contrib as per bug #385665
> [ 1 ] Choice 2: fluidsynth should remain in main despite bug #385665
> [ 2 ] Choice 3: Further discussion
> - - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Ian.
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GjkfN1rxMNPe1RcXPUBLvsc=
=GoTE
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----



Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Anthony Towns <aj@azure.humbug.org.au>:
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Message #137 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Anthony Towns <aj@azure.humbug.org.au>
To: 385665@bugs.debian.org, debian-ctte@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 02:44:12 +1000
[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]
On Thu, Mar 29, 2007 at 10:18:49AM -0600, Bdale Garbee wrote:
> - - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> [ 2 ] Choice 1: fluidsynth should move to contrib as per bug #385665
> [ 1 ] Choice 2: fluidsynth should remain in main despite bug #385665
> [ 3 ] Choice 3: Further discussion
> - - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Rationale: based on bug log, fluidsynth doesn't require anything non-free.

Cheers,
aj

[signature.asc (application/pgp-signature, inline)]

Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Manoj Srivastava <srivasta@debian.org>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #142 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Manoj Srivastava <srivasta@debian.org>
To: debian-ctte@lists.debian.org
Cc: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 20:00:14 -0500
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[ 2 ] Choice 1: fluidsynth should move to contrib as per bug #385665
[ 1 ] Choice 2: fluidsynth should remain in main despite bug #385665
[ 3 ] Choice 3: Further discussion
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        I tend to give more weight to the license of the software
 itself; which in this case is free; that the supposed intent of the
 users (there was the WEP cracker software recently introduced,
 despite people complaining it was a black hat only tool -- and
 countered by other people saying it can have security uses).

        I also found compelling the scenario that even if users used
 free software in conjunction with non-free data/drivers, there is
 potential for free data/drivers to be created, and then users shall
 find a tested, well known, free software suite ready to go the rest
 of the way.  Let not perfect be the enemy of the good.

        manoj
-- 
"'To the Workers of the world, I am sorry.' -- Karl Marx" Seen on the
side of an East German factory
Manoj Srivastava <srivasta@debian.org> <http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/>
1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272 D093 B493 410B  924B 21BA DABB BF24 424C
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Information forwarded to debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org, Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>:
Bug#385665; Package tech-ctte. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Technical Committee <debian-ctte@lists.debian.org>. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #147 received at 385665@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>
To: 385665@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Sun, 01 Apr 2007 09:26:12 -0600
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bdale@gag.com (Bdale Garbee) writes:

> - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> [ 2 ] Choice 1: fluidsynth should move to contrib as per bug #385665
> [ 1 ] Choice 2: fluidsynth should remain in main despite bug #385665
> [ 3 ] Choice 3: Further discussion
> - - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

The discussion in the bug log makes it clear to me that fluidsynth belongs 
in main.

Bdale
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Reply sent to Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>:
You have taken responsibility. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Notification sent to Bas Zoetekouw <bas@debian.org>:
Bug acknowledged by developer. Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #152 received at 385665-done@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox):

From: Bdale Garbee <bdale@gag.com>
To: 385665-done@bugs.debian.org
Cc: debian-ctte@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#385665: Call for vote: fluidsynth: Move to contrib
Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2007 22:18:27 -0600
bdale@gag.com (Bdale Garbee) writes:

> I hereby call for an immediate TC vote on the question of whether fluidsynth 
> should be moved to contrib, requested by bug #385665.  

With 4 of 7 TC members voting, the outcome is no longer in doubt... fluidsynth
remains in main.

Bdale



Bug archived. Request was from Debbugs Internal Request <owner@bugs.debian.org> to internal_control@bugs.debian.org. (Mon, 18 Jun 2007 13:46:58 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

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